I don't think it would be unpopular for me to say that most taxpayers believe there is huge waste in government, up to and including the government's spending.
While DOGE is not a good long-term solution, it's so far better than literally any other major effort by a US government entity to combat waste at the federal level - which is to say that it's literally the only one that I've ever heard about in my lifetime.
$15 million for condoms to the Taliban through USAID.
$446,700 to promote the expansion of atheism in Nepal through the State Department.
$1 million to boost French-speaking LGBTQ groups in West and Central Africa through the State Department.
$14 million in cash vouchers for migrants at the southern border through the State Department.
$20,600 for a drag show in Ecuador through the State Department.
$47,020 for a transgender opera in Colombia through the State Department.
$32,000 for an LGBTQ-centered comic book in Peru through the State Department.
$55,750 for a climate change presentation warning about the impact of climate change in Argentina to be led by female and LGBT journalists through the StateDepartment.
$3,315,446 for “being LGBTQ in the Caribbean” through USAID.
$7,071.58 for a BIPOC speaker series in Canada through the State Department.
$80,000 for an LGBTQ community center in Bratislava, Slovakia through the State Department.
$3.2 million to help Tunisian migrants readjust to life in Tunisia after deportation through the State Department.
$16,500 to foster a “united and equal queer-feminist discourse in Albanian society” through the State Department.
$10,000 to pressure Lithuanian corporations to promote “DEI values” through the State Department.
$8,000 to promote DEI among LGBTQ groups in Cyprus through the State Department.
$1.5 million to promote job opportunities for LGBTQ individuals in Serbia through USAID.
$70,884 to create a U.S.-Irish musical to promote DEI in Ireland through the State Department.
$39,652 to host seminars at the Edinburgh International Book Festival on gender identity and racial equality through the State Department.
$425,622 to help Indonesian coffee companies become more climate and gender friendly through USAID.
this post is a posterchild for everything that is wrong with the US society today. I truly hope you do not believe in what you wrote here and just trolling :)
A major recent one was what DOGE is using as a vehicle. The DSGS was set up in the Obama administration to replace thousands of different IT departments with a single one.
Increasing government efficiency was a major Obama plank which he partly delivered on.
People certainly believe there is huge waste in government, but that doesn't make it true - people believe all sorts of incorrect things. Politicians have been running for years on plans to cut "waste, fraud, and abuse" in government spending, but I suspect there's a lot less fat than the average taxpayer thinks.
There is fat, but I'd venture not much on the CDC, FEMA or USAID. A big part of this mess is that fat is concentrated on areas that are very unpopular to cut, like military expenditure, or in legacy processes and systems that will take years and a lot of upfront investment to streamline (and that DOGE won't touch).
If you meet an average government worker in the US, you quickly realize how little they make and how understaffed their departments tend to be. People underestimate how complex government work is and how different it is from what you do at a regular business.
So instead of a department of Education for example, what should all that money go towards? Resegregation of schools under the title of school vouchers instead of Jim Crow?
So you'll use your money to fund scholarships for smart but poor students, fix the roads by my house, pay for basic scientific research that might not benefit you personally ever.?
Or just screw society if you're personally fine right now.
"which is to say that it's literally the only one that I've ever heard about in my lifetime"
^ That statement is doing a lot of heavy lifting in your general sentiment. And (not meaning this as a personal attack at all) it's a huge problem for our society as a whole if citizens are more in favour of large scale destruction of institutions based on a lack of understanding that has been pushed by the same economic class benefiting from the wholesale destruction of democratic institutions.
There are numerous entities that do good work in the government to combat waste. You just don't hear about them because it's not a sexy topic that the media gets clicks from. Unfortunately, those entities are being shut down by DOGE, so sadly, it's not a start of anything good.
Randomly destroying things without actually understanding why they are important is a very short term view on reducing waste. Fixing things if/when they go wrong is going to be expensive.
Not a US citizen but I know my fair share of bureaucratic processes from my home country Germany. That being said it’s one thing to start a process to limit overspending without simple budget cuts which can be more hurtful. That’s why you need an actual audit to figure out what is and what isn‘t waste or inefficient. Inefficient also doesn’t mean shutting things down. Maybe improving processes and leverage the people better etc.
Then comes the whole topic of who is in charge. It’s still baffling that an unelected person can conduct official government business. I understand how the system works in the US but one would think that in order to be granted this much power, that some checks have to fly by congress / senate (not that this would make a difference since there is only the party line no conscience voting) before this person can set out to dismantle US agencies.
For me that is not a start. Why not bring a person from big Pharma in to audit and reform the FDA. While at it let’s some Exxon guys evaluate the environment regulations etc etc. You can‘t let the wolf guard the sheep.
I don't think it would be unpopular for me to say that most taxpayers believe there is huge waste in government, up to and including the government's spending.
No one wants wasteful spending. The difference is that DOGE proponents are totally okay with threatening the lives of over 20 million people.
While DOGE is not a good long-term solution, it's so far better than literally any other major effort by a US government entity to combat waste at the federal level - which is to say that it's literally the only one that I've ever heard about in my lifetime.
Perhaps you're very young. Every few years there have been "Hoover-style" commissions that have resulted in bipartisan efficiency optimizations, without the mass disruptions (that will end up costing taxpayers even more money) and threats to safety of millions of people.
This is your lucky day, because you get to learn about the Government Accountability office! Formed literally over 100 years ago to literally provide professional and non-partisan audit and investigative services to the government! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Government_Accountability_Offi...
This is probably a good time to do some reflection on your current world view. You thought that it seemed possible, and possibly even likely that the largest and most powerful government in the world was operating completely without any sort of accounting checks as it worked with literal trillions of dollars a year, and that none of the hundreds of thousands, possibly millions of people who make up the workforce of this organization had any motive to try and responsibly carry out their duties and spend their money. They were all just irredeemably committed to flagrantly wasting your money and enriching themselves on your tax dollars, instead of taking seriously the responsibility they had.
As it turns out, this is just a completely ludicrous fantasy. There are already numerous mechanisms in place to combat fraud and waste, staffed by competent professionals who generally try their best to uphold the trust granted to them. Some of them might even be your friends or neighbors. They're people, just like you, and are generally trying to do a good job and move society forward.
In any multi-trillion dollar organization there is going to be waste and fraud. Like the battle against entropy it can never be fully won, its an ongoing battle that is fought each year. There will be scandals of misspent money, and victories of services delivered for good value on the dollar spent. Its not some sort of black and white, good vs evil struggle, and the fact you thought that literally no one had every thought to do this before should probably give you pause the next time you start to think about politics.
Yes, when there's a MOT (major ongoing topic) [1], especially a MegaMOT like this one, we try to have the frontpage threads be about significant new information (SNI) [2], rather than opinion pieces. The latter tend to count as follow-ups [3], and those tend to be bad for HN because they're repetitive [4].
"The individuals unleashed on the Kwajalein Atoll are not rocket scientists — they lack the expertise, qualifications, and methodology required for real rocketry. At best, they’ve compiled a list of components that _might_ liftoff, but rocketry is a rigorous process requiring analysis, time, and, crucially, actual rocket scientists."
While clever, this is just flat out not true. Many (if not all) of the early SpaceX employees did indeed have backgrounds in aerospace and mechanical engineering.
Anyone who has dabbled in KSP [1] knows that all it takes for lift-off is sufficient engine power and fuel storage plus enough struts to keep it all together until reaching orbit. If at first you don't succeed, add more engines and struts. If you don't succeed at all at least you'll have a spectacular explosion.
DOGE has also very specifically targeted the CFPB and, according to The Verge, the team within the organization specialized in understanding Big Tech’s entrance into financial products (Musk is supposedly about to launch X's banking services).
I have a proposal to increase government efficiency both at short-term and long-term:
- gov must stop subsidizing corporations
- gov must stop subsidizing rich people
Because if gov stop spending money with people and corporations that already have enough money to not need any help gov can spend the money with people who actually needs help.
I don't think it would be unpopular for me to say that most taxpayers believe there is huge waste in government, up to and including the government's spending.
While DOGE is not a good long-term solution, it's so far better than literally any other major effort by a US government entity to combat waste at the federal level - which is to say that it's literally the only one that I've ever heard about in my lifetime.
It's a start.
I have never seen a large organisation without waste. That doesn't mean the organisation needs ripping up
"taxpayers believe" is very different from "there actually is".
$15 million for condoms to the Taliban through USAID.
$446,700 to promote the expansion of atheism in Nepal through the State Department.
$1 million to boost French-speaking LGBTQ groups in West and Central Africa through the State Department.
$14 million in cash vouchers for migrants at the southern border through the State Department.
$20,600 for a drag show in Ecuador through the State Department.
$47,020 for a transgender opera in Colombia through the State Department.
$32,000 for an LGBTQ-centered comic book in Peru through the State Department.
$55,750 for a climate change presentation warning about the impact of climate change in Argentina to be led by female and LGBT journalists through the StateDepartment.
$3,315,446 for “being LGBTQ in the Caribbean” through USAID.
$7,071.58 for a BIPOC speaker series in Canada through the State Department.
$80,000 for an LGBTQ community center in Bratislava, Slovakia through the State Department.
$3.2 million to help Tunisian migrants readjust to life in Tunisia after deportation through the State Department.
$16,500 to foster a “united and equal queer-feminist discourse in Albanian society” through the State Department.
$10,000 to pressure Lithuanian corporations to promote “DEI values” through the State Department.
$8,000 to promote DEI among LGBTQ groups in Cyprus through the State Department.
$1.5 million to promote job opportunities for LGBTQ individuals in Serbia through USAID.
$70,884 to create a U.S.-Irish musical to promote DEI in Ireland through the State Department.
$39,652 to host seminars at the Edinburgh International Book Festival on gender identity and racial equality through the State Department.
$425,622 to help Indonesian coffee companies become more climate and gender friendly through USAID.
First, I would appreciate a citation for each of these.
Second, perhaps you can explain to me why it is necessary to threaten the health and safety of 20 million people instead of specific targeted cuts?
https://www.devex.com/news/scoop-usaid-kenya-partner-has-no-...
Soft power is an undervalued thing that is hard to build.
It's hard to quantify how much the US benefits from promoting (what was previously) its values in other countries.
I bet its more than the $40m (or, to put it in perspective, 12 cents per citizen) that this list adds to.
You've been lied to
this post is a posterchild for everything that is wrong with the US society today. I truly hope you do not believe in what you wrote here and just trolling :)
Is this 'waste'? Until the last election, it was not. These were considered "american values".
https://apnews.com/article/trump-usaid-court-lawsuit-constit...
I would prefer it if they they stopped
A major recent one was what DOGE is using as a vehicle. The DSGS was set up in the Obama administration to replace thousands of different IT departments with a single one.
Increasing government efficiency was a major Obama plank which he partly delivered on.
More examples: Clinton balanced the budget, and Carter cut more government regulation than Reagan did.
People certainly believe there is huge waste in government, but that doesn't make it true - people believe all sorts of incorrect things. Politicians have been running for years on plans to cut "waste, fraud, and abuse" in government spending, but I suspect there's a lot less fat than the average taxpayer thinks.
Compare budgets in 2024 ( $6.752 trillion) vs 2015 ($3.688 trillion)
Where are these numbers from? I see 2015 (4.89 trillion): https://fiscaldata.treasury.gov/americas-finance-guide/feder...
And let's correct for inflation.
2015 4.89 trillion is 6.503 trillion, which means the budget only went up 249 billion, or 3.83% over that 10 year span.
The number is from https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2015_United_States_federal_b...
Total expenditures $3.90 trillion (requested) $3.688 trillion (actual)[3] 20.6% of GDP[4]
There is fat, but I'd venture not much on the CDC, FEMA or USAID. A big part of this mess is that fat is concentrated on areas that are very unpopular to cut, like military expenditure, or in legacy processes and systems that will take years and a lot of upfront investment to streamline (and that DOGE won't touch).
If you meet an average government worker in the US, you quickly realize how little they make and how understaffed their departments tend to be. People underestimate how complex government work is and how different it is from what you do at a regular business.
And most people believe there's too much crime. The DOGE answer to that is to round up people indiscriminately.
(Not entirely indiscriminately — gotta get those political opponents!)
All while crime is plummeting and has been for a long time.
So instead of a department of Education for example, what should all that money go towards? Resegregation of schools under the title of school vouchers instead of Jim Crow?
How about the money just remains in the citizens bank accounts to use as they please?
So you'll use your money to fund scholarships for smart but poor students, fix the roads by my house, pay for basic scientific research that might not benefit you personally ever.?
Or just screw society if you're personally fine right now.
yet 4.5T tax cuts which is also govt spending.
"which is to say that it's literally the only one that I've ever heard about in my lifetime"
^ That statement is doing a lot of heavy lifting in your general sentiment. And (not meaning this as a personal attack at all) it's a huge problem for our society as a whole if citizens are more in favour of large scale destruction of institutions based on a lack of understanding that has been pushed by the same economic class benefiting from the wholesale destruction of democratic institutions.
There are numerous entities that do good work in the government to combat waste. You just don't hear about them because it's not a sexy topic that the media gets clicks from. Unfortunately, those entities are being shut down by DOGE, so sadly, it's not a start of anything good.
Randomly destroying things without actually understanding why they are important is a very short term view on reducing waste. Fixing things if/when they go wrong is going to be expensive.
Look how the same process failed to turn Twitter into a profitable enterprise!
I don't know if you're being serious, but Twitter's financials are not in any better shape since Musk took over.
I'm intrigued how you read and understood my comment? I thought I said that this approach had failed?
I read it sarcastically, due to the exclamation point. May have been a misread on my part.
Not a US citizen but I know my fair share of bureaucratic processes from my home country Germany. That being said it’s one thing to start a process to limit overspending without simple budget cuts which can be more hurtful. That’s why you need an actual audit to figure out what is and what isn‘t waste or inefficient. Inefficient also doesn’t mean shutting things down. Maybe improving processes and leverage the people better etc. Then comes the whole topic of who is in charge. It’s still baffling that an unelected person can conduct official government business. I understand how the system works in the US but one would think that in order to be granted this much power, that some checks have to fly by congress / senate (not that this would make a difference since there is only the party line no conscience voting) before this person can set out to dismantle US agencies.
For me that is not a start. Why not bring a person from big Pharma in to audit and reform the FDA. While at it let’s some Exxon guys evaluate the environment regulations etc etc. You can‘t let the wolf guard the sheep.
No one wants wasteful spending. The difference is that DOGE proponents are totally okay with threatening the lives of over 20 million people.
https://www.devex.com/news/scoop-usaid-kenya-partner-has-no-...
Perhaps you're very young. Every few years there have been "Hoover-style" commissions that have resulted in bipartisan efficiency optimizations, without the mass disruptions (that will end up costing taxpayers even more money) and threats to safety of millions of people.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hoover_Commission
This is your lucky day, because you get to learn about the Government Accountability office! Formed literally over 100 years ago to literally provide professional and non-partisan audit and investigative services to the government! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Government_Accountability_Offi...
This is probably a good time to do some reflection on your current world view. You thought that it seemed possible, and possibly even likely that the largest and most powerful government in the world was operating completely without any sort of accounting checks as it worked with literal trillions of dollars a year, and that none of the hundreds of thousands, possibly millions of people who make up the workforce of this organization had any motive to try and responsibly carry out their duties and spend their money. They were all just irredeemably committed to flagrantly wasting your money and enriching themselves on your tax dollars, instead of taking seriously the responsibility they had.
As it turns out, this is just a completely ludicrous fantasy. There are already numerous mechanisms in place to combat fraud and waste, staffed by competent professionals who generally try their best to uphold the trust granted to them. Some of them might even be your friends or neighbors. They're people, just like you, and are generally trying to do a good job and move society forward.
In any multi-trillion dollar organization there is going to be waste and fraud. Like the battle against entropy it can never be fully won, its an ongoing battle that is fought each year. There will be scandals of misspent money, and victories of services delivered for good value on the dollar spent. Its not some sort of black and white, good vs evil struggle, and the fact you thought that literally no one had every thought to do this before should probably give you pause the next time you start to think about politics.
Short opinion piece, no new information. Just someone ranting.
Yes, when there's a MOT (major ongoing topic) [1], especially a MegaMOT like this one, we try to have the frontpage threads be about significant new information (SNI) [2], rather than opinion pieces. The latter tend to count as follow-ups [3], and those tend to be bad for HN because they're repetitive [4].
[1] https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que...
[2] https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&so...
[3] https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que...
[4] https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&so...
Thanks for everything you do here, dang.
You think security would be a bit tighter at the treasury. HN seems more secure when this post gets 37 points in 10 minutes.
"The individuals unleashed on the Kwajalein Atoll are not rocket scientists — they lack the expertise, qualifications, and methodology required for real rocketry. At best, they’ve compiled a list of components that _might_ liftoff, but rocketry is a rigorous process requiring analysis, time, and, crucially, actual rocket scientists."
While clever, this is just flat out not true. Many (if not all) of the early SpaceX employees did indeed have backgrounds in aerospace and mechanical engineering.
You're quite right, I stand corrected; I thought it was only Mueller with direct experience :)
Anyone who has dabbled in KSP [1] knows that all it takes for lift-off is sufficient engine power and fuel storage plus enough struts to keep it all together until reaching orbit. If at first you don't succeed, add more engines and struts. If you don't succeed at all at least you'll have a spectacular explosion.
[1] https://www.kerbalspaceprogram.com/
In 2015 I had a MAGA coworker walking around proudly saying "Trump is gonna fire everyone."
Turns out she was right, just a bit early.
Somehow not surprising to see this take on the front page. How embarrassing.
DOGE's biggest targets thus far have been FEMA and USAID. These two orgs are actively monitoring Musk and his companies?
Seems like at least USAID was:
Alleged USAID Probe Into Starlink Raises Elon Musk Conflict Concerns.
https://www.newsweek.com/usaid-elon-musk-starlink-probe-ukra...
DOGE has also very specifically targeted the CFPB and, according to The Verge, the team within the organization specialized in understanding Big Tech’s entrance into financial products (Musk is supposedly about to launch X's banking services).
https://www.theverge.com/policy/612933/cfpb-tech-team-gutted...
Accurate
I have a proposal to increase government efficiency both at short-term and long-term:
- gov must stop subsidizing corporations - gov must stop subsidizing rich people
Because if gov stop spending money with people and corporations that already have enough money to not need any help gov can spend the money with people who actually needs help.
Do you understand that times are changing and complaining/whining on the internet is just over?