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Maybe a better URL could be: http://gameshelf.jmac.org/2008/11/grim-fandango-puzzle-desig...
I found Grim Fandango in a pile of discounted games as a tween in the 2000s. There was a cool skeleton in a suit on the front cover, so I bought it based on that.
Even though I didn't understand most references and sarcasm, few games have grabbed my attention as Grim Fandango did. The art work, the music, the writing. The whole game oozes of style that I've never seen replicated.
Even some 20+ years later I can almost recite most of Act I from heart. If you haven't played this game and like adventure games, this is one of the best.
Thank you for linking OP, this made my morning.
I played the demo and it's been at the top of my "to play" list for decades. For one reason or another, I just never have yet. Majora's Mask is also at the top.
Not to be a downer about a masterpiece game but…the demo ends right before the game starts proffering anti-logic puzzles.
Well worth playing the remastered version. It makes the control a bit more bearable but otherwise feels like the original.
There are a few bad puzzles (especially one regarding infernal critters) that one can use a guide for, but mostly it was a blast to finish it back in the day. Such a unique story by itself and then in a rare comedy / noir style on top! It's kind of crazy how they even came up with it.
I still remember the feeling of the ending, and the end credits music when the violin kicked in as it played the Manny & Meche theme! The music is at least as good as this game.
Soundtrack is dope as well
Majora’s Mask is fantastic
Do it, it's a beautiful work of art.
I have never played through Grim Fandangoo in full, but in my peer group memes from this game permeated so thoroughly that when I see a pigeon I will too often end up shouting at it, "Run you pigeons! It's Robert Frost".
Unique game. Also to think that they pulled out that beautiful 3D toon feel before toon shaders were made.
Same for most LucasArt games, Day of the Tentacle, Monkey Islands, and the others
I first played it in my 40s when the remaster came out, and it's one of the best games I've played. It holds up incredibly well, particularly with the modernized controls.
So if anyone is wondering if this is just nostalgia, or if the game actually holds up, it's the latter. Just play it.
I remember playing it back in the day and I was severely unimpressed. Compared to Full Throttle it just felt clunky and the 3d art wasn't nearly as good as the amazing pixel art. I ended up never finishing it.
You're missing out; give the Remastered/Extended/whatever edition a try
It released with unbearable keyboard controls instead of the familiar point-and-click. If I remember right a remaster eventually came out that allowed mouse control.
I agree that I hated the 3d though. This was a bad patch for games when everyone wanted to go 3d for the sake of it, even though it looked and played worse.
Yeah the keyboard controls were awful, apparently it was because they wanted the game to have a console port using a gamepad.
Thing is I bet the people who played it are right too, I just never managed to bring myself to play more than a few hours of the game before getting frustrated. Bad controls + 90s point-and-click-puzzle-design + early 3d graphics is not a good recipe.
Full Throttle was criticized for its dumbed-down point-and-click (basic only 3 actions + using items, instead of the usual verbs), but that was the sweetspot for my early-teens mind. Can never get enough funny responses of using the lick action.
LucasArts then made the same mistake with Escape From Monkey Island, because they were targetting the PlayStation 2
Same, it's one of those things that stays with you for life.
For similar feels, check out Disco Elysium
Planescape Torment
and almost anything by Amanita Design
When I initially saw the game characters, I thought "this is janky". But by the end of the game, their personalities had won over my heart.
Tim Schafer is really good at this. Psychonauts has a large cast of deformed-looking characters, but you'll love them all by the end.
Is this a walkthrough or a game design document?
As a walkthrough, it is nice. But as the foundation for the game designers, it would be a fun because it is so lighthearted.
Looks like Tom Schafer style; I find him whimsical and funny in all of his communication. I don't think it's a stretch that this aspect extends to nom-public communications.
Design document, from the page that links this pdf (http://gameshelf.jmac.org/2008/11/grim-fandango-puzzle-desig...):
"Tim Schafer at Double Fine has posted the puzzle design spec for his classic adventure game, Grim Fandango. It is that game's tenth anniversary; it was released on the Day of the Dead, 1998."
It's a game design document.
My guess is it is kinda like a first draft that some higher ups approve and budgets and then dialogue and game development and puzzle testing can begin.
Looks like a GDD but just for the puzzles, a PDD
This game is iconic!
Yes. Literally one of the best.
The small square box at the very end of the document, with accompanying text, is just delightful:
All over the document, you can see Tim Schafer "wasted his time" by adding personality (jokes, graphics, asides) to what is basically an internal document.
I think in 2026 a document lovingly crafted like this would be deemed a great waste of time, lack of efficiency and an affront to shareholder value.
Always fascinating to peek behind the curtain at how these classics were built. Grim Fandango had some truly brilliant, and occasionally maddening, puzzles.
Ahha, this document came to my attention last night from this video [0] that bubbled in my YouTube recs - I don't know if it's the same for OP or just a coincidence, but I highly recommend it too:
GDC Talk: "One Page Designs", by Stone Librande
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E9_wLks1kAg
I came here to post just this.
That GDC talk just showed up on my YouTube frontpage this morning and I watched it. And now I check HN and here we are.
Seems like ultimately they aren't actually able to track us as well as they claim.
I've been playing most of Lucas Arts games with my 10 y/o daughter. Grim Fandango is the one she has liked the best. It is not perfect, has lots of bugs (crashed on several occasions) and weird things, but the atmosphere is so cool.
Monkey Island comes second of course.
And this comment will prove it, by referencing only the very first part of the document, being the comment most likely to garner upvotes and replies, as opposed to deeper nuanced comments.
Nice, Tim Schafer is someone whose writing I really admire, if you haven't checked it out yet Double Fine (the studio he leads) documented the entire (7 year!) development cycle of Psychonauts 2 in a 32 episode documentary series, and it in my opinion one of the best documentaries ever made. It covers a lot of cool stuff, like Covid, them getting acquired by Microsoft, big project leadership struggles. It's long as hell but it is really worth your time if you have an interest in creative work in large teams.
https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLIhLvue17Sd70y34zh2erWWpM...
They are currently doing a company wide gamejam/game idea incubation thing, after surviving Microsoft undoing the acquisition and the same Documentary crew is doing a doc about that (they did a kickstarter campaign to fund it)
I have a love/hate relationship with Grim Fandango.
I love the world, the characters, the music, and the art style. It was so inspiring for me as a child.
I literally hate the puzzles and the gameplay.
Same here, I bought it when it came out in one of those nice carton boxes. It was rather buggy and hard to play without a walkthrough. The characters, the music, the story, the dialog, it's all so memorable and easily makes up for those bugs and hard puzzles. I played the remaster when it came out on PS4 as well, still great, but perhaps that's just the nostalgia.
Agreed. I actually didn't find it buggy when I bought it in 1998. I loved the box art.
I recently went through it from start to finish as an adult and found it an incredible slog to get through. The puzzles, to me, made zero sense, which sucks the fun out of the game because the only possible way to solve them is to just try everything with everything or to look up the solution.
The latest Monkey Island. Now THAT's how you make a point-and-click adventure game!
That is the difference between Gilbert's game design versus Schafer's. I much prefer Gilbert.
Obligatory link to The Digital Antiquarian's treatment of the game:
https://www.filfre.net/2024/11/grim-fandango/
Absoltely crazy amount of detailed work
Grim Fandango was one of the first games I bought out of my own pocket. And as was the norm back then, this used up all my games budget for months, so I had to stick to this game, for better or worse, for a long time. I remember it took me a very long time to even find the Tube Room, it's easy to miss unless you do the 3D equivalent of pixelhunting to find the place where you need to take a turn. And boy, was I stuck in Rubacava!
I also remember that it was slightly difficult to buy the game - I was at least 13 at the time, the game had an age rating of 12, but (gasp!) there were skeletons on the cover, and the tag line mentioned corruption and crime. So the lady in the shop actually called her boss before eventually selling the game to me.
I would sometimes just let the game idle at the casino level and just listen to the mellow jazz. That game was a piece of art.
I have started playing Grim Fandango with my kids (7 and 9) after we played through Day of the Tentacle together. Playing old adventure games on the TV and letting people take turns playing is a great family activity!
They aren't native English speakers and the story in Grim Fandango is considerably harder to follow compared to DoTT, so they lost interest a bit after we completed year 1. But as soon as their English skills improve, we'll get back to it, it's one of my favorite adventure games!
I wonder how easy it would be to translate it today with LLMs and have a translated version running on ScummVM
Isn't ScummVM 2D only?
Nope, they integrated their sister project, ResidualVM, that does 3d
Are the remasters not translated? I remember playing Day of the Tentacle, Grim Fandango, and all the other LucasArts games when I was a child, and they were dubbed in French.
EDIT: I checked, and I was mistaken: DOTT was never dubbed in French, but Grim Fandango (and its remaster) is.
Some are, but I'm Danish and I think they translated any of the games to that :)
My favorite game of all time. This is awesome
Interesting so much
Grim Fandango is interesting because they are responsible for Lua’s popularity as a gaming scripting language:
https://www.lua.org/doc/hopl.pdf
I wonder who made the drawings they are really pretty. I love this game, thanks for the post!
Peter Chan was the concept artist for this game (as well as several other LucasArts and Double Fine ones)
Nostalgia activated. I now have to play Grim Fandango! Loved that game!
I wonder how does this fits in the general Game development pipeline
Is it Story -> Characters -> Puzzles?
Theme -> Characters -> Story -> Puzzles?
Or everything everywhere all at once?
Are the character descriptions in this doc leading the Story or derived from it?
How much of the story is built around Gameplay and its limitations? (I think I remember GF requiring 2 CDs?)
I never understood why people like Grim Fandango so much. I know many people who absolutely love it (and some more here on the replies) but I never did.
I've finished it with a walkthrough so I've seen the entire game. Between an art style that didn't age well and didn't grab me even then, obscure puzzles and a theme that doesn't interest me so much, I think it is one of LucasArts worst adventure games. But that's me. Let's call it "polarizing".
If you look at the 2nd to last page of the PDF you can see Tim Schafer's deception where he hadn't actually designed the ending puzzle by the time the document was due.
I'm glad I used a walkthrough when playing the game, because even after beating it I still have no idea how the hell the Chain puzzle worked.